What Causes House Fires with Fire Captain James Walker

Fire Captain James Walker shares his 24 years of firefighting experience with us to better educate and bring awareness to common causes of home fires. Look, we all get complacent in our own homes and ignore potential fire hazards with everyday bad habits.
Are you cooking dinner on the range and then going outside to watch the kids while the open flame is unattended in the kitchen?
Are you lighting candles next to flammable materials?
Are you falling asleep with a lit cigarette?

If yes to the above you need to listen to this podcast.

Click the links below to better educate your family of the risk of fire in your home.

https://www.usfa.fema.gov/statistics/residential-fires/cooking.html

https://osfm.fire.ca.gov/media/8428/updated-smoke-alarm-requirement-ib-september-2014.pdf

Transcript

John Laforme: 0:00

Buying a home. Don't panic. Just listen to the rest of this podcast Hey, everybody, we're back. Welcome back to the buying a home don't panic podcast. And today we're going to talk about what causes house fires. And today's guest is James Walker. How you doing?

James Walker: 0:27

Good. How you doing today?

John Laforme: 0:29

Very good. So you are a firefighter? Yes. So can you tell me about that, like your experience and all that?

James Walker: 0:36

Yeah. So born and raised here in California. I've been a firefighter here in California for almost 24 years now. Wow. Yeah, started off. Going to school for it. Got my fire science degree. Did some explore time with the city of Pasadena. And then I worked out in the desert. And I've been with my current department now for 17 years. And my current position is I'm a captain with my department.

John Laforme: 1:15

Right on, that's awesome. You're a big boy too. But Oh, thanks. Your shoulders, your shoulders are they look like they're about eight inches wider than mine.

James Walker: 1:23

You're looking good there, too.

John Laforme: 1:26

It looks like you could actually carry a ladder. That's good. That must be a tough, that must be a tough thing to qualify for. Don't you guys have to do go through some serious physical training to to get if you're going to part as part of your acceptance. Yes. How does that work

James Walker: 1:45

though? They have two different types of tests. One's called a, a Biddle. And the other one is called a C Pat. Test. And it's a number of different evolutions, I guess you can say and everything's timed. It's really hard to pass. I know some will probably say it's not that hard, but it's definitely made to be challenging. Dragging dummies, lifting ladders? Crawling, right.

John Laforme: 2:24

There's a lot of dummies out there. There is. So well, no, that's interesting. And as you were saying that I remembered something. I used to have one of my friends from jiu jitsu from years ago. Jamie Walsh. He was a personal trainer too. And I had him training me for a while and I remember one time he was training a female firefighter and she passed. She made it because oh man, I worked her she was she was strong as an ox when she went she went in there.

James Walker: 2:53

Yeah. So as a matter of fact, my engineers a female, nice definitely holds her own. There's there's plenty of females that can do the job for sure.

John Laforme: 3:05

A case all you guys out there who are just living in the stone age don't know it. There's a lot of tough women out there. I train with some of them. They have striking ability that you wouldn't believe and I got I gotta watch my ass when I'm training with these women, as they are just as sharp as anybody else. Don't Don't underestimate anybody's what I always say. Absolutely. So here's a very important question I was thinking of when you're on your way over here, and I'm like, Have you ever met fire marshal bill?

James Walker: 3:35

No, I have not. Do you know who that is? I don't personally, but

John Laforme: 3:41

Jim Carrey from In Living Color. Remember him? Yeah, let me tell you something. Funny. That was the funniest skit ever. Yeah, he looks like he's a dead dead. He's looks like he's a dead guy. And he's a firearm. That is so funny. I looked it up this morning. I'm like, I gotta ask him.

James Walker: 3:59

You know, that's funny, though. Because I right away started thinking of the real fire marshal. Ah, well, a friend of mine that just retired. His wife works for the fire marshal. No kidding. Oh, that's funny.

John Laforme: 4:14

Well, I also was under the kitchen sink this morning doing some cleaning. And I saw my fire extinguisher. Probably not a good place for that to be right. under the kitchen sink.

James Walker: 4:26

Actually, it's that's not a bad place for that. But it is out of sight out of mind. Yes. Will it be in there? Yeah. But it is in the facility of the kitchen, everything cooking. So

John Laforme: 4:41

as long as any buried in the back, we can't find it. That's all good. So there's a lot of things to talk about today. I've been wanting to have a firefighter come on here for some time because, you know, I'm dealing with houses and when I walk into houses, I see tons of fire safety issues, whether it be door egress, Window egress, no smoke detectors in the kid's bedrooms, which makes me cringe. And I look at the homeowners I'm like, and I say something to him was, well, I'm what you did to get your ass down to Home Depot, like right now. And protect your family. Right? So nonsense. So that's what I run into a lot. And some of the living conditions are also firehouse, just because some people are just dirty, and they just don't care. Right. So I guess we could just talk about this. Fire extinguishers for a second. Okay. I mean, what do you recommend? What does the fire department recommend any, any size home? have on hand? So for example, an average 2015 102,000 square foot house, is there a certain number of there should be in the house? or would there normally would you recommend more? If it was a much bigger house? I mean, what how would you how would you scale that?

James Walker: 6:03

Right? So this is probably probably about a two pound

John Laforme: 6:07

that's a basic, that's a basic use

James Walker: 6:09

basic use right there for for anything that's within a home. So that's considered a an ABC extinguisher. It has a dry chemical in it. So your ABC is for your A is for ordinary combustibles your B is for like grease fires. Or any type of chemical in your your C is for energize electricals. So on the side of that extinguisher, it does have a rating there. So it's going to cover a certain square footage, it wouldn't be a bad idea to have multiple extinguishers. So this right here is is going to put out a stove fire. Okay, we'll

John Laforme: 6:59

put out a stove fire.

James Walker: 7:01

Oh, absolutely. Okay. Yeah, so it's not only what the makeup is inside of a, an extinguisher, it's also how it actually is used. Right. So there's, that was my next thing. So there's something that we call pass on how to use the extinguisher. So you're pulling that pin out, right, and then you're aiming. And then you're, you're, you're squeezing and you're sweeping, would be your last part of that pass. So you're supposed to hit the base of a fire. Right? So you're pulling that pin, you're aiming at the base, you're squeezing that trigger sweeping. Right, so you got to that fire.

John Laforme: 7:45

So if you don't know already, everybody out there, you're gonna, well, first of all, you got to break this little white white strap right here. And then you got to pull this pen out, don't have this facing your face, turn it this way. And then once you pull the pen out, then you could push this down and grab the handle. And then what what what James is saying is point down and then sweep across, is that

James Walker: 8:08

correct? Absolutely. So back to it's more of? Well, it's not more of but the technique has a lot to do with how effective anything's going to be offer on a fire,

John Laforme: 8:21

like using anything, anything you buy, if you don't use it properly. It's not going to work, right?

James Walker: 8:24

Absolutely. But I would recommend multiple extinguishers. And those in the garage is a great place. Yeah,

John Laforme: 8:31

I have one of my garage. So So is there a set point that you can recommend like under the kitchen sink or in the kitchen vicinity? One in the garage? Anything? Anywhere? Any other part of the house? Maybe?

James Walker: 8:46

I mean, you can put them in multiple areas but under the sink for sure in the kitchen just like where you put it down in the garage.

John Laforme: 8:54

And you say kitchen because that's the number one place for fires. Correct?

James Walker: 8:58

Absolutely. Absolutely. And not only is that the number one place, but that is the number one cause of home fires. Right is in the kitchen cooking fires.

John Laforme: 9:12

Got it? Got it. So before we go any further into the kitchen fires you meant the first thing you mentioned here was a basic combustibles so let's make it very clear for everybody listening what a basic combustible is. That's anything that can catch fire right?

James Walker: 9:28

Yeah, so an ordinary or basic combustible is your your organic materials. So wood paper anything that's not a synthetic would be your ordinary combustibles

John Laforme: 9:41

right like so you're cooking something on the stove you get the gas going to get the electric heater got what doesn't matter, the elements go on, and you get the paper towels right there next to it. Hello, you know, little common sense, peeps

James Walker: 9:55

does. That's a very good, very good point that you just made right there is all that stuff. within that area is what's going to catch fire.

John Laforme: 10:03

Yeah, yeah. So it's those little things that start fires because you just not, you're not thinking you might leave it on just, you might be turning off your gas thinking it's all the way off. And it's not because you have a blocked with pots and pans, cooking utility, whatever, right? Like cutting boards, whatever, you might have a cutting board on top of a wood cutting board, don't put a wood cutting board on top of your range and then walk away from it. It could catch fire. Absolutely. It's wood. So absolutely. So that's what combustibles are anything that's going to go puff? Yes. Just turned into a nightmare. So back to the kitchen fires, is it? It? Well, let me ask, let me just say this first, it's been my experience going into some homes. As I mentioned a few minutes ago, some people just very dirty. They cook a lot, and that's fine. But they don't clean. And there's grease coating. Everything that was grease, combustible it is it is. So even if it's a layer of it on your cabinet, there's a chance that that could ignite faster without it. Absolutely. Okay. So yeah, I mean, I've been in some houses where I won't even touch the range, I won't physically touch it, I won't even test it. Because it's so covered with grease. I want nothing to do with it. It's just like filth. So I'll just walk, I'll just make a note did not inspect. Because it's filthy, right? There's grease everywhere. So I just put a limitation there.

James Walker: 11:32

Right. And that's what that that be on the side of that extinguisher is representing is the grease fires. So that dry cam that's in an extinguisher right will take care of that. I see that be property of the grease fires.

John Laforme: 11:52

So it's a good recommendation to tell people right now that you know if you got a bunch of grease buildup on your rangehood or anywhere around, just wipe it up clean. Absolutely. Gotta keep gotta keep that clean. Not to mention, it's really filthy. It's not sanitary, either. So all right, interesting. So cooking is number one. Anything else you taught? Can you mention about cooking that might be helpful?

James Walker: 12:16

Yes. You mentioned being being there in the kitchen. I believe that you said that. While cooking. That's that's the number one thing is being aware that you actually are cooking something. We've all done it we've all left stuff. Yep, that's cooking, right? Because we have something else on our mind, we go take care of the kids. Yep, that's the number one thing to to not have a fire is to be aware that you that you are cooking and not to leave the kitchen. Second thing would be is to have a lid somewhere in that area. So if a fire did start, and you you caught it early, you can cover that, that fire up. So we have what is called a fire triangle. And if you take out one of those elements, then you're not going to have fire. So you have to have fuel, which is that grease that we're talking about.

John Laforme: 13:13

I feel like I'm back in school. I know I'm trying and now I got to think about it. And I'm like, Did you see my brain start turning when you said that? One of my eyes starts twitching. So now I'm like okay, let me see if I remember it. Oxygen. Yes. That's all I remember. What's What's the rest

James Walker: 13:35

and then heat. Heat. Okay, so that makes up the fire triangle. You take out one of those parts, like putting the lid on it. Well, you're you're taking that oxygen out Right, right. Oh, yeah. So the lid

John Laforme: 13:50

wasn't there. One more?

James Walker: 13:52

Well, that was a triangle. The triangle? Yeah, so it's your fuel. Fuel. That's right fuel, which is the grease.

John Laforme: 13:59

Okay, hang on. I got a cyber slap myself. I should have known that.

James Walker: 14:04

That's right. Yeah. So putting the lid over it will displace the oxygen right? Yep. And then definitely, we have kids kids in the house. You have to watch those. Those fires for sure. Oh, you're cooking. You know, cuz we do go on a lot of kids that that get burned. Unfortunately, a lot

John Laforme: 14:31

of calls. A lot of calls. Yeah. The Do you have a lot of calls where the kid steps on the door and the range tips over? Yeah. So so as a home inspector, we always check for to see if there's an anti tip bracket installed. And if it's a really old unit, you know, it's not there right. Now if you know it's in a rental unit, you know, it's not there. So anything older, they're always missing. And what that means is if you if you get stuck on the rain And, you know, pots filled with hot water or stews or whatever you got on there, and you walk away from the kitchen. You know, just like you mentioned, don't be walking away from the kitchen, you gotta be aware when you're cooking, you need to stay in the kitchen, right? So, and then the little one comes up opens the oven door, maybe it's already open and steps on our sits on it. And that weight anyway, how heavy the kid is, can tip that range right over and everything on top is gonna fall right on that kid. Absolutely. That's super dangerous. It is an anti tip bracket is just a $20 piece. It's a little, it's a little of a challenge to put it in. Because you do have to slide out the range and maybe disconnect the fuel line, you got to kind of disconnect it to get all that in there. So I wouldn't try it yourself if you're not handy. But you really need to do it. So that's one of the number one things in kitchens that that I write up. For sure. So, okay, so what's your experience with heating equipment? Like, you know, old floor gravity heaters or baseboard heaters or anything like that.

James Walker: 16:05

So one of our areas that we respond to they have a lot of older homes. And occasionally we'll get

John Laforme: 16:12

an older What do you think? 50s or 20s 30s? And

James Walker: 16:18

40s? Sorry, okay. Okay. Yeah, so we'll occasionally get those, those structure fires from those those type of heating elements. That's probably about my extent of what was there not too often. Not too often. Okay. Those type of fires. But the number one fire that we usually get in, it's in our colder, colder months is going to be from from chimneys. chimney fires, space here fires, but chimney fires,

John Laforme: 16:51

chimney fires is big.

James Walker: 16:52

Yeah. People don't clean them.

John Laforme: 16:55

Yeah, nobody. Nobody even thinks about their fireplace until they pull on want to put a log in it. Right? That's about it, or turn it off its gas if it's a gas fueled one. But yeah, that's a really good point. Because as a home inspector, a lot of home inspectors comment on fireplaces, I particularly do not at all, I let people know right up front, when they call me. Don't ask me to look at your fireplace, I don't have the tools or the training to read to get inside the important part of that fire that chimney flue and let you know what's going on there. That's where the problems arise. Those things are disconnected there. There's big gaps where the heat just builds up. And then it ignites that wood on the other side, because it just gets so hot. And that's why a level two chimney inspection should be done at minimum not a level one a level one is me looking at this computer right here and going oh, yeah, it looks great, right? Cosmetically, it looks great. But I can't tell if it's functioning properly, cuz I'm not going to go in your house and light a fire. That's all we do. You know, so we're not gonna go test your fireplace, but a chimney specialist they can. They'll come in, that's what they do. They know exactly what they're doing. They have the tools to scope that thing out and really let you know what's going on. So a level two chimney inspection should be part of every home inspection for a house that has a fireplace and chimney.

James Walker: 18:24

So what is it that you that you're telling your, your client?

John Laforme: 18:30

I let when they call me. They will always ask do you do chimney? I'm like, I do not do chimney? And if they ask why not while this other guy did? And I said, Well, he probably told you at the end to get a chimney specialist. Right? Right. Yeah, he did. Well, I'm just trying to save you the trouble so you can get through your transaction easier. Because I'm going to tell you that everyone's going to tell you that that's what we that's what we have to do. Right? So there's some things in a house that I feel that I can give a good opinion of, like I can test it enough or visually inspect it enough to say you know what, I'm comfortable telling you this you know, like a heating and cooling system is the thermostat on the wall I'm going to turn it on just like the homeowner would and I'm going to run it through it but I know what to listen for I know what to look for. I could get a gauge as to check temperatures and stuff like that so I have I have enough experience and tools to give him an honest opinion of what I think what's going on the age of it so forth and all that stuff but with Geminis I don't have that I don't have that ability so the

James Walker: 19:39

the exterior of it on the inside the hurt the box all that what do you

John Laforme: 19:44

I stay away from all of it? Yeah, I stay away from all of it. I don't want even go down that that rabbit hole. Well, how can we looked at that and not this? Right. That's a question that could come up later. So that's how you got to think okay, yeah, when you're thinking about that stuff. So it's either you inspect it, or you don't. Right. That's That's how, that's how I roll in that. Okay, so heating as far as heating equipment goes in a house. I cringe sometimes when I see the electric wall heaters in the bathroom, and they got a towel rack right above it. Right. And then there's the towel hanging there. Me being me. Can everybody do not turn this on with that towel there? And you'd be surprised at how many people Oh, wow, that's a good point. They just weren't thinking of it. Right. It's just we get very complacent living, though we we live in a house. We just complacent. Done it. It's fine, man. Who cares? Just the towel. I'll buy another one. Right? Yeah, you will along with buying a new house. Right? Because it's a whole thing burnt down. Absolutely. So those things get very hot. They do those electric heaters. Keep your kids away from those heaters to those are dangerous, right? For our little one.

James Walker: 21:02

Yeah, you should. You should keep everything about three feet away. Yeah, a good three foot spray air all the way around any type of right heating source.

John Laforme: 21:16

Yeah, even going back to the gravity flow grills, right. And the old you know, 1920s 1930s, sometimes 1940s homes. I see drapes, like right over them. And I'm like, right? fire hazard right there. That's just common sense. That's gotta remember, heat. People think well, there's no fire. So how something's gonna catch fire. They're not aware of the heat element that the amount of heat it takes to ignite something. And that's what most people just are not aware of. That's why we're here today, talking about this stuff. Because those are the things people just don't think of. Right? It goes along the same lines as when I tell people about swimming pools, I inspect swimming pools. And when I tell them, that it's not only their family, they got to worry about drowning in the pool is the neighbouring they'll like whoa, I never thought of that. Just, you know, kind of planting seeds. Absolutely. You know what I mean? So it's it goes right along those lines. So

James Walker: 22:18

everything that we're talking about, is it all starts with awareness? There you go. That's the word. I remember growing up that in our house, we always had drapes in the kitchen. You don't really see them anymore. Something else that the you that you had mentioned is how things catch on fire. Well, I've gotten fires that were actually started from linseed oil. Sitting in the garage, that hole when when something D oxidizes, or like rust how, like a battery. Absolutely. That chemical reaction that happens. Yeah, we've gone on fires that started in garages, because somebody left rags in the corner full of linseed oil. So,

John Laforme: 23:19

so over time, air over time, and time just turns those chemicals into something else. Wow.

James Walker: 23:26

So you don't necessarily need an actual lighter a match. Right? Right for fire to start. So but the whole

John Laforme: 23:33

battery thing, I watched it documentary or some kind of prior wasn't a document quite some short video on on, on what can happen with batteries. If you have a bunch of batteries. Like if you stock up on batteries, you're going to keep an eye on them, as they will start corroding inside the package. If they're all in there together. I guess there's some kind of a event that will happen where they can. I don't have the correct technical term for it. And it starts fire,

James Walker: 24:01

right. Yeah, so a chemical decomposition. So it's just changing state is what it's doing. And yeah, those are bad. Bad fires. A lot of the electric cars now. Fire departments will show up. They'll think that the fires are out. And they'll reignite at some point a day later. Two days later. Oh, wow. Yeah, so there's a there's a lot of awareness right now going on.

John Laforme: 24:34

There's a lithium batteries. Correct. Right? With the lithium batteries. So lithium batteries. You gotta be careful. Yeah. And your phone. You gotta be careful with lithium batteries altogether. It doesn't matter what what component it's in it. You gotta really be careful. So my understanding is if, if the battery itself is just overheated on its own, let's say the battery is not even in the In the component like for example, my cordless drill, if that battery is fully charged, and it's just sitting out and it's in an area where it's, it just gets hotter and hotter and hotter. I'm told that that can be a problem right there. Absolutely. They just get too hot on their own because of where it's stored, right, so I'm very calm. I have a lot of lithium stuff. I have a lot of lithium batteries and I'm always cautious to unplug stuff after charged. So it's not there's no electrical source going to it. Right. Take it off the charger. i Yeah. Somebody I know told me recently they they had a flashlight, and they put it in there. They put it in their pocket or the battery itself. They put it in their pocket. And they caught fire in their in their pants pocket. And I'm like, was that a bear battery? Right? Yeah. Yeah, why would you do that? There's two ends of that battery positive and negative. And if you maybe have a coin or a quarter right all those all those things? This is just a real world I live in. Right? That's just the shit that happens. Yeah, so I'm sure if you put a flashlight in your pocket that was had the battery inside the flashlight, there wouldn't be a problem. I'd be really surprised that that was the case.

James Walker: 26:21

Yeah, I've had my phone in my pocket and I feel it heating up. Yeah. Oh,

John Laforme: 26:26

yeah. So don't leave it on your dashboard.

James Walker: 26:28

Yeah, good point.

John Laforme: 26:29

Good point to leave it there. Let's see careless smoking. You mentioned careless smoke and tell me about that. What's going on with smokers?

James Walker: 26:38

Yeah, so careless smoking. Obviously you don't want to be smoking when it's time to go to bed give fires that either are laying in bed or on the people have been smoking while they're on the couch leaving cigarettes around the house and ashtrays it's just a it's a bad it's a bad situation bad habit. bad habit to

John Laforme: 27:09

get into habit to smoke in the first place. That's a bad habit. Leave them around the house. Gotcha. Yeah, I don't smoke.

James Walker: 27:16

Yeah, I I never smoked either.

John Laforme: 27:20

Some people I know smoke cigars. I still don't forget I still don't understand that they've

James Walker: 27:24

ever tried it

John Laforme: 27:27

maybe when I was really young stupid. Maybe

James Walker: 27:31

you have smoked a cigar a couple times? Yeah. I don't like it. I do not like

John Laforme: 27:37

I think I did do it once and I think it made me sick right? Actually yes, I now remember that. Yeah, thanks for bringing that bad memory back.

James Walker: 27:45

I don't like them. Cuban or whatever it is. I don't like

John Laforme: 27:49

so electrical equipment. This is something I can chime in on too because I've seen quite a few of these fire hazards right? Okay, I had you first

James Walker: 28:00

as a guest we've been on a number of electrical fires whether it's considered handyman wiring or not

John Laforme: 28:13

you don't know that till you get there right.

James Walker: 28:16

I don't know that unless a fire and arson investigator tells me that okay that it was handyman wiring but as you know that just old wiring in general doesn't have to be handyman. It can just be old wiring,

John Laforme: 28:31

knob and tube cloth covered wiring aluminum wiring. Yeah,

James Walker: 28:34

right. So a lot of our electrical fires starting garages, from handyman wiring. People wiring, I saw a video of yours. I think it was a short not too long ago, in an attic. And there were splices that weren't in junction boxes. Correct. That's my life every day. We get those fires in attics, quite quite often. And those

John Laforme: 29:01

can be started by little varmints chewing on the wires. Absolutely. They light themselves on fire. And that catches everything else. Extra for sure.

James Walker: 29:10

Absolutely. Yeah. So something to take away from from electrical fires is don't put a bunch of extension cords into one. What would it be? Not a GFI. But

John Laforme: 29:30

yeah, like plug extension? Yeah, like a little far away. I'll get four plugs going into one outlet. Yeah, it's Christmas time. Everyone does that during Christmas, but I see it behind a lot of TV sets too.

James Walker: 29:42

Right. So make sure that that stuff is is listed. Yeah. UL listed. UL listed is one of the big third parties. I can go on without electrical stuff. Have

John Laforme: 30:01

if you got a three prong if you got a three prong cord, and you only have a two male and you have a two prong female Don't be pulling that ground off that opposite appliance or whatever you got as it needs to have a ground

James Walker: 30:17

so a funny not funny funny story but a story about that is one time we were on a structure fire and one of the guys was leaning up against I think it was a metal framing from a sliding door or something and he got shocked from it. So somehow the house wasn't grounded from the from the fire. So I don't know how that happened. But

John Laforme: 30:47

I've heard of that also happening where you can go into a yard and touch us walk on a certain part of the ground and you'll get zapped. Okay, so there's some kind of a there's some kind of electrical short going on somewhere. Right? And, and I watched this one guy on YouTube elect electrical guy and he was like, check this out. And I was like, Whoa, that is so dangerous. You walked in the backyard. And and he could feel it. He got snapped a little bit it wasn't like a you know electrocution but it was it was some good amount of energy there and he gets we get a little zap and he goes this is from this and he I can't it was so long ago. I can't remember exactly what caused it. But that was woke me up. I was like, wow, I gotta be careful that rocking around someone's house.

James Walker: 31:35

Yeah, so Yeah, watch what you're plugging in. If if wires have breaks or any exposed wires, yeah, leave them alone. Don't touch them. Don't try to plug them in. It if if you do smell anything that that seems to be burning. Pay attention to it. Because that can start a fire behind walls. Look for for any type of charging on receptacles

John Laforme: 32:04

Yep. loose connections.

James Walker: 32:08

loose connections for anyone on receptacles Absolutely. Yep.

John Laforme: 32:13

So electrical so basically, you know, that's one of the main parts of my job is you know, main job of a home inspectors safety right. Horrible wiring is plenty some around this. There's tons of it out there. So going into attics seeing knob and tube wiring covered with insulation. That's a huge nono right there. Right? If there's knob and tube in a house, there should be no insulation, because that's how they built on pack though, right? So I was just in a house just a couple of days ago. And I saw a bunch of it looks like this coming out of the junction boxes there's a bunch of wires if there was a junction box a lot a lot of this house didn't have any. And turns out they had Romex connected to some knob and tube and only a couple areas that were easily visible. But then as I was making my way across the attic I mean I'm really watching more walk and and I could see oh wait a second. That looks like a knob and tube right there. Yep. But my sniffer on it lets up like a Christmas tree. And then I just started moving a little insulation. I could see it was going through the whole thing. It could have easily been overlooked because there's just enough insulation to kind of conceal it. But because I saw it visibly in a couple other small areas. It made me look a little a little harder. And yeah, that the wiring under the house in the attic. There's still two prong receptacles mixed around with three prong receptacles that's it that's a dead giveaway right there. When you see two prong receptacles in a in a house today that's being sold. I mean, come on. Right. I should have been upgraded years ago. Absolutely. So that you can't there's no grounding whatsoever on that might have a two wire system in it. This house has a two wire system. Pretty interesting. So I've been replacing wiring in here. Okay, you little by little so yeah, let's see what other electrical stuff electrical panels what the main ones are? Federal Federal Pacific statblock. You familiar with those? Right? Yeah. I actually have one on this house. Right now. It's still in service. I'm getting ready to do a major electrical upgrade here does it triple. Like it hasn't done anything wrong yet? So yeah, I've been watching it. I've been real cautious about what I do with it haven't haven't added anything that could make it you know, start malfunctioning. I haven't put any extra stress on it and other words, but I do want to get rid of that soon. But I gotta do a whole relocation. I gotta put my I gotta remove that panel where it is certainly 100 amp. I'm gonna put a 200 amp behind the garage, and then go underground from the pine the garage to the house. Put a sub panel on the house. So I got a whole plan to do, but it's just a lot of manual labor, I got to suck out the driveway and really trench it out. I gotta do all that. So as the cooler weather gets here, I'll jump on that. I'll be doing that soon.

James Walker: 35:15

So let me ask you a question about that. So if you have a house that you're inspecting, and it's similar to this, what is your recommendation to a client with this type of wiring system?

John Laforme: 35:30

Well, I just make them aware of it. Okay, I'm not here to I'm not here to. I'm not here to scare him, or tell him don't buy it. Right. I'm like, Look, you know, you have an older home. First of all, you know, I like to point out the obvious people, you are aware of the age of this house? Oh, yes. That's built in 1940s. Okay. So with that, if nobody living here over these years has upgraded everything, well, then you still have older systems in place. Meaning electrical wiring, electrical panel, and maybe some other things I found, right. So I didn't make them aware of it. So my recommendation is, have electrician come out further evaluate your electrical system, check everything, and they'll recommend what you need to do. So that's how I do

James Walker: 36:16

right. Yeah. Yeah, back to for for homeowners, it's another thing too is making sure that the kids aren't stick sticking things anything any metal objects into those receptacles? Yeah, yeah. I know you and I can we can probably go deep into it's fine. Yeah. Electrical. I'm trying to keep it just basic for Yeah, they have

John Laforme: 36:48

their have their little plastic protectors, you can put in their receptacles. And for a home inspector, that's a nightmare. We show up, everything's plugged. Everything's covered the cat, the cabinets are got locks on them, and it slows us it slows me down. And it's, it's a real big nuisance for us. But I get it, you know, I'm gonna get mad about it and recycle. Okay. And it'd be an extra 30 minutes. Just trying to unlock the homeowners of them like, Hey, can you unlock everything? Please? Right? open all the windows for me. I mean, open all the shades, whatever blinds. So yeah, there's a lot of things to do with electrical. So there is the way I summarize electrical is anything electrical as a potential safety hazard. Whether it's personal electrocution, shock, or fire,

James Walker: 37:39

right. So be aware of it. It does.

John Laforme: 37:42

That's just the world I live in, right. I mean, I've done stupid shit in the past few years ago. Absolutely. Working on a receptacle without without turning off the power. My screwdriver got zapped Luckily I didn't get zapped. I've been there. Man.

James Walker: 38:01

So yeah, so don't plug a bunch of stuff in make sure that it's listed that you're not buying us this cheap stuff. Yeah, watch the kids around it.

John Laforme: 38:11

Yeah, candles. For all you romantics out there.

James Walker: 38:16

Yeah, so candles is a another big one. How home buyers start. If you're gonna be lighting candles, make sure that you're again, staying in the room that you're not leaving them around. We had we had a fire one time. Unfortunately, somebody lost their life behind candles. And it's because they left the candles unattended. I would say try and go. Flashlights now. Instead of instead of candles. The holidays come up. Right?

John Laforme: 39:05

Yeah, a lot of scented candles. A lot of people like to use scented candles. That's fine. Just remember don't put it underneath the drapes. Absolutely. Don't put it next set of paper towels is usually common sense. A lot of this is common sense. For sure. Yeah.

James Walker: 39:19

Right. That three foot rule again? Yeah, with candles, combustible is

John Laforme: 39:24

it on a wood table? Right? Is it on a granite table or a granite countertop? That's different. You know, having some Granite Falls over granite is not going to catch fire. Right? Everything around it might. Right? You gotta be careful. So a lot of that's just common sense

James Walker: 39:41

monitoring.

John Laforme: 39:42

So wake up everybody.